Drugs: Should they all be legalised?

No seriously.... serious issues in here please..

Moderator: Moderators

Dannnn
Cool Snail
Cool Snail
Posts: 7224
Joined: 09 Apr 2002, 00:21
Contact:

Drugs: Should they all be legalised?

Post by Dannnn » 08 Apr 2007, 19:01

About a year or two ago, if asked whether all illegal drugs should be legalised, I would have laughed and said no, even though I smoked weed and occasionally dabbled in 'stronger' stuff.

Now, however, in my opinion, it makes perfect sense. With the recent revelation that alcohol and tobacco are more hazardous to the body than cannabis, ecstasy and other drugs, it does not make sense to have the latter drugs outlawed.

If drugs were legalised, they could be regulated by the government, meaning all the nastier elements could be taken out of the drug. For example, ecstasy would be sold as pure MDMA, instead of pills containing only 0.1mg of MDMA, like a lot of them do.

Also, socially, surely it would be beneficial? Skag heads wouldn't need to rob for their fix; gang crime would be reduced because there would be no demand for an illegal drugs market. It all seems to make sense.

What's your take on it? Are there more pros than cons or cons than pros, in your opinion?

all_against_all
Wannabe Slug
Wannabe Slug
Posts: 643
Joined: 20 Jan 2005, 21:49
Contact:

Post by all_against_all » 08 Apr 2007, 20:22

In short, i'd say i am 100% for legalisation of all drugs, makes perfect sense. And as a side note i'd like to say that alcohol is a cunt of a drug that everyone thinks is perfectly acceptable to completely abuse.

metal_dave
Snail God
Snail God
Posts: 20772
Joined: 22 Jul 2003, 23:05
Contact:

Re: Drugs: Should they all be legalised?

Post by metal_dave » 09 Apr 2007, 01:36

BrennuvargR wrote:About a year or two ago, if asked whether all illegal drugs should be legalised, I would have laughed and said no, even though I smoked weed and occasionally dabbled in 'stronger' stuff.

Now, however, in my opinion, it makes perfect sense. With the recent revelation that alcohol and tobacco are more hazardous to the body than cannabis, ecstasy and other drugs, it does not make sense to have the latter drugs outlawed.

If drugs were legalised, they could be regulated by the government, meaning all the nastier elements could be taken out of the drug. For example, ecstasy would be sold as pure MDMA, instead of pills containing only 0.1mg of MDMA, like a lot of them do.

Also, socially, surely it would be beneficial? Skag heads wouldn't need to rob for their fix; gang crime would be reduced because there would be no demand for an illegal drugs market. It all seems to make sense.

What's your take on it? Are there more pros than cons or cons than pros, in your opinion?



as if alcoholics never rob to fund their habit?

i dunno. people are always gonna get addicted to things they can't afford.


i might have more input tomorrow, but as it stands, i'm cunted.
Image

Dannnn
Cool Snail
Cool Snail
Posts: 7224
Joined: 09 Apr 2002, 00:21
Contact:

Post by Dannnn » 09 Apr 2007, 01:47

Heh, good point.

I think some pro-legalisation types believe heroin addicts should get free hits from the government. While the proportion of addicts to non-addicts really is small, I don't think I agree with that idea, mainly because the addicts would, presumably, not be helping the country in any real positive way.

I still think most, if not all, drugs should be legalised, though.
Image

User avatar
garymcnally
Snail
Snail
Posts: 5923
Joined: 01 May 2003, 14:09
Location: Stoke on trent
Contact:

Post by garymcnally » 09 Apr 2007, 08:00

Allthough the addicts at that time may not be "helping the country" I think it si important to remember that the country is made up of the people within it. And that the people are more important than "the country"

Personally I think that all drugs should be legalised, or criminalised, not some half arsed mix of the two. I think the current situation we have with certain drugs being legal but most being illegal is just stupid.
Happy now? :'-(

User avatar
phillip_banks
Snail
Snail
Posts: 5178
Joined: 24 Sep 2003, 12:37
Location: Wood-To-Tha-Motherfuckin'-Cote
Contact:

Re: Drugs: Should they all be legalised?

Post by phillip_banks » 09 Apr 2007, 10:45

metal_dave wrote:
BrennuvargR wrote:About a year or two ago, if asked whether all illegal drugs should be legalised, I would have laughed and said no, even though I smoked weed and occasionally dabbled in 'stronger' stuff.

Now, however, in my opinion, it makes perfect sense. With the recent revelation that alcohol and tobacco are more hazardous to the body than cannabis, ecstasy and other drugs, it does not make sense to have the latter drugs outlawed.

If drugs were legalised, they could be regulated by the government, meaning all the nastier elements could be taken out of the drug. For example, ecstasy would be sold as pure MDMA, instead of pills containing only 0.1mg of MDMA, like a lot of them do.

Also, socially, surely it would be beneficial? Skag heads wouldn't need to rob for their fix; gang crime would be reduced because there would be no demand for an illegal drugs market. It all seems to make sense.

What's your take on it? Are there more pros than cons or cons than pros, in your opinion?



as if alcoholics never rob to fund their habit?

i dunno. people are always gonna get addicted to things they can't afford.


i might have more input tomorrow, but as it stands, i'm cunted.


I think the main point he was illustrating was that heroin addicts are more likely to steal for drugs than alcoholics are for drinks due to;

a) Heroin being more addictive than alcohol
b) Heroin being more expensive than alcohol.

User avatar
jeff_crap_in_the_head
Snail Trainee
Snail Trainee
Posts: 3995
Joined: 21 Jul 2005, 14:43
Location: Chad
Contact:

Post by jeff_crap_in_the_head » 09 Apr 2007, 23:42

I dont get the argument that we should legalise drugs because alcohol and tobacco are legal. They're bad for you, but they're so accepted within society and used so extensively that banning them would be impossible. Other drugs however are also dangerous (and the amount of deaths recorded from drugs is not the only measure i would use to determine how detrimental a drug is to your health), so why legalise them? They dont have the acceptability the other two do, and neither should they.
It may be unfair, or seem to be to some, but society imo will be a hell of alot better without crack and meth being legalised, or even cannabis.

end of rant *prepares for slating from hippies*
Pogonophobia is the fear of beards.
Image

User avatar
garymcnally
Snail
Snail
Posts: 5923
Joined: 01 May 2003, 14:09
Location: Stoke on trent
Contact:

Post by garymcnally » 10 Apr 2007, 05:02

Surely if you're are just harming yourself you should be aloud to take whatever you want?

I personally dont like the double standard that if you take ONE type of drug, then you're fine, but taking pot, coke, ecstacy etc. is illegal. I respect people enough to make their own decisions. If you're harming no body else but yourself, then WHY do we need to criminalise it?

Are we going to legislate against people who self harm? Or people who dont eat their 5 portions of fruit and vedge a day?
Happy now? :'-(

Ginger
Snail
Snail
Posts: 5085
Joined: 11 Jan 2004, 18:16
Contact:

Post by Ginger » 10 Apr 2007, 08:59

garymcnally wrote:Surely if you're are just harming yourself you should be aloud to take whatever you want?

I personally dont like the double standard that if you take ONE type of drug, then you're fine, but taking pot, coke, ecstacy etc. is illegal. I respect people enough to make their own decisions. If you're harming no body else but yourself, then WHY do we need to criminalise it?

Are we going to legislate against people who self harm? Or people who dont eat their 5 portions of fruit and vedge a day?


Because people do harm others with these illegal drugs. If you begin to legalise things like cannabis and coke the emphasis on the others will be decreased. Heroin users won't stop stealing just because its legal to do it. They'll still be shit faced and unable to work and need to fund their habit.

Also imagine if rohypnol was legalised? Hello date rape.
Image

User avatar
chippy
Snail Of Satan
Snail Of Satan
Posts: 30353
Joined: 18 Aug 2003, 20:39
Location: Newbury
Contact:

Post by chippy » 10 Apr 2007, 09:16

Ok.

Firstly, why would legalising heroine stop people from stealing to feed their habit? People would still be addicted to it and still need money for it. And no, no-one should be given it for free, for the same reasons that booze and fags shouldn't be given out on the NHS. It would be an unfair burden on taxpayers.

Secondly, it's a thorny issue. I took some acid on friday. It was fucking strong and the resulting trip could have been terrifying for a lot of people. As it was, it was incredible, but if I was less experienced and hadn't had such good people around me, it could have been a bad time. I don't think stuff like that should be available to just anybody. Let the people who really want it seek it out rather than sticking it on every street corner for any idiot to get hold of. On the other hand, I would have found it incredibly unfair if we had got in trouble, given that we were just being hippies in the park, enjoying the sun and not troubling anyone.

The only drug I think should be legalised to some extent is weed. And even then, dealing should still be illegal, but everyone should be allowed to grow a small amount for personal use. It's much cheaper and safer (in that you don't have to deal with dealers). Maybe ecstasy, but in a very controlled manner. But people shouldn't be given open and easy access to coke, heroine, etc. That shit ruins lives and damages society.

And finally: Anna, rohypnol isn't illegal. It's a controlled subtance, a prescription drug, like Valium. People can get hold of it if they want to, and I don't think the fact that is it controlled would stop a would-be date rapist. FYI, rape IS illegal, and I can't really imagine someone thinking "hmmm you know what, I really feel like raping someone tonight.. oh shit hang on, rohynpol's illegal isn't it? i'd better not bother then, don't want to get in trouble." Besides that, we aren't really talking about that sort of drug here, we're talking about recreational drugs.

also:

Ginger wrote: If you begin to legalise things like cannabis and coke the emphasis on the others will be decreased.


cannabis and coke are very, very different things. you seem to be grouping them together somehow?

Also also:

BrennuvargR wrote:With the recent revelation that alcohol and tobacco are more hazardous to the body than cannabis, ecstasy and other drugs, it does not make sense to have the latter drugs outlawed.


Cite your source please. Are you referring to the recent reclassification recommendations that took in to account social harm etc? I wasn't aware that there had been any straight-up announcement that booze and fags are more harmful than "other drugs" (little vague don't you think?)

also also also:

Ginger wrote:Because people do harm others with these illegal drugs.


But people harm others with legal drugs as well?
Image They reckon one day you'll be able to wake up and eat a yoghurt you can have a conversation with.

User avatar
jeff_crap_in_the_head
Snail Trainee
Snail Trainee
Posts: 3995
Joined: 21 Jul 2005, 14:43
Location: Chad
Contact:

Post by jeff_crap_in_the_head » 10 Apr 2007, 10:30

garymcnally wrote:Surely if you're are just harming yourself you should be aloud to take whatever you want?

I personally dont like the double standard that if you take ONE type of drug, then you're fine, but taking pot, coke, ecstacy etc. is illegal. I respect people enough to make their own decisions. If you're harming no body else but yourself, then WHY do we need to criminalise it?

Are we going to legislate against people who self harm? Or people who dont eat their 5 portions of fruit and vedge a day?


I think it's also a moral issue. The issue with tobacco companies is there, people are becoming addicted and paying money for something that kills you, but as i explained it's impossible to ban. People dont profit from you not eating 5 a day or harming yourself, but companies could make huge profits from selling people countless harmful, and addictive drugs. That is not going to happen, the government has a duty to protect its citizens, and allowing companies to sell heroin, e's, meth or whatever is hardly doing so.

Also you're not just harming yourself, look at alcohol, people get into fights and a huge amount of crime is due to it. Imo doing the same with drugs such as coke or whatever is asking for trouble, not only may people end up stealing to fund there habit, but with such drugs, other crimes may go up, violent crimes and such.

Also, you may respect people enough to make there own decisions, unfortunately peer pressure or group mentality states otherwise, not only that, but there are some fucking idiots out there who i wouldnt respect to make sound judgements on anything.
Pogonophobia is the fear of beards.
Image

User avatar
chippy
Snail Of Satan
Snail Of Satan
Posts: 30353
Joined: 18 Aug 2003, 20:39
Location: Newbury
Contact:

Post by chippy » 10 Apr 2007, 10:52

I don't think there is a yes/no answer to whether drugs should be legalised. They are all very different and as such each merits looking at on an individual basis. Most of them, however, shouldn't be.
Image They reckon one day you'll be able to wake up and eat a yoghurt you can have a conversation with.


User avatar
chippy
Snail Of Satan
Snail Of Satan
Posts: 30353
Joined: 18 Aug 2003, 20:39
Location: Newbury
Contact:

Post by chippy » 10 Apr 2007, 12:34

:scratch:
Image They reckon one day you'll be able to wake up and eat a yoghurt you can have a conversation with.

User avatar
phillip_banks
Snail
Snail
Posts: 5178
Joined: 24 Sep 2003, 12:37
Location: Wood-To-Tha-Motherfuckin'-Cote
Contact:

Post by phillip_banks » 10 Apr 2007, 15:24

chippy wrote:I don't think there is a yes/no answer to whether drugs should be legalised. They are all very different and as such each merits looking at on an individual basis. Most of them, however, shouldn't be.


I agree with this, but hypothetically, if all drugs were legalised, do you honestly believe thousands of people that don't take heroin would suddenly rush out to buy it? I guess some would but I can't see a significant increase in users just because it's legal. I think with stuff like acid, draw, K (to an extent) and pills then it does seem a little strange that these things are illegal because they're predominantly used for recreation, on the odd occasion when you want to break down the doors of perception. Which a lot of people do. I'm not saying they're completely harmless, but they're in a completely different league to crack or smack which are the drugs that do serious harm. With the right approach and education, I fail to see why as a sensible adult, i'm denied the right to choose what I take for enjoyment. But, as I said, the same thing cannot be said for the hardcore shit that fucks people up big time.

User avatar
chippy
Snail Of Satan
Snail Of Satan
Posts: 30353
Joined: 18 Aug 2003, 20:39
Location: Newbury
Contact:

Post by chippy » 10 Apr 2007, 15:43

This is true. However I fear that not everybody can be trusted to make a well considered decision.

Of course if you did legalise them it would depend on the scale of availability, but if thing were being sold in newsagents I do fear you would get a high proportion of new users out of sheer boredom and ignorance.
Image They reckon one day you'll be able to wake up and eat a yoghurt you can have a conversation with.

User avatar
phillip_banks
Snail
Snail
Posts: 5178
Joined: 24 Sep 2003, 12:37
Location: Wood-To-Tha-Motherfuckin'-Cote
Contact:

Post by phillip_banks » 10 Apr 2007, 21:52

chippy wrote:This is true. However I fear that not everybody can be trusted to make a well considered decision.

Of course if you did legalise them it would depend on the scale of availability, but if thing were being sold in newsagents I do fear you would get a high proportion of new users out of sheer boredom and ignorance.


Even if they were legalised though, I think the terms of purchase would be slightly more stringent then just walking down to your local Forbuoys.

all_against_all
Wannabe Slug
Wannabe Slug
Posts: 643
Joined: 20 Jan 2005, 21:49
Contact:

Post by all_against_all » 10 Apr 2007, 23:40

Well the way i see it, who's in control of drugs in the UK at the moment?

A bunch of criminals, who may (or may not be) using the money to fund other criminal activities, and quite possibly abusing people and their rights in order to bring it into the country and sell it on the streets.

There's always going to be a market for drugs, so why don't the government take control of it rather than let a load of cunts make loads of money as well as making the drug impure (see coke/heroin/even weed has glass in it now). If (all drugs) were legal, consider the following -

- It would allow for more/better tests on the harm/effects of the drugs
- The drugs would be pure :)
- It would stop funding other organised crime
- Would potentially lower the levels of associated gun crime/violence/prostitution on the streets
- They could be used medicinally to great help (as well as cutting costs of other more expensive treatment offered instead)

There's loads of other things, something being illegal is a great way for it to be 'cool' to a 15 year old and i think if drugs lost that status a lot less people would start taking them. Salvia is legal and only restricted as much as alcohol is (18+) and when i did the x35 i was absolutely fucked for 5 minutes, a stronger trip than i've ever had with shrooms and its only the few experiences ive had tripping my nuts off that stopped me having a total freakout.
So the funny thing is, it's a powerful, legal hallucinogenic that's easily obtained; if acid were legal and could be bought by 18/21s and over from pharmacys (as i would expect it to) then the potential risk to children is tantamount to what already exists, besides the fact that most hard drugs could be bought on the rougher streets of the uk by kids anyway.

The drug policy at the moment is such a total mess i fail to see how legalising it and restricting the sale of it could make things much worse.

The addictive nature of heroin is something that sets it apart from all other drugs but seeing as most other drugs do limited damage to your body with infrequent use, it's a decision that us as adults should be able to make for ourselves. As Gary pointed out, we all probably neglect to look after our bodies in other ways (lack of fruit/excercise/mental stimulation etc) but again that is our decision to make as adults, and all of them will end up costing the nhs if we get ill so don't see how it's any different.

The media is currently hyping cannabis to shit, rags like the daily mail are making utterly unfounded claims about weed and its effects (IT WILL MAKE YOU A PSYCHO KILLER) and i don't like the way it's heading.
I know he was joking but:

"Some people say alcohol's a drug. It's not a drug, it's a drink."

^^ That sums up for me peoples attitude to alcohol abuse because it's not considered an illegal drug, and is also therefore utterly risk free comparitively to their clouded views of the realities of other drugs.

User avatar
chippy
Snail Of Satan
Snail Of Satan
Posts: 30353
Joined: 18 Aug 2003, 20:39
Location: Newbury
Contact:

Post by chippy » 11 Apr 2007, 08:45

Some bloody good points there. Although I do think general usage would increase if certain things were more obtainable.

On a tangent, are you still seeing grit weed about? I haven't seen any for ages.
Image They reckon one day you'll be able to wake up and eat a yoghurt you can have a conversation with.

all_against_all
Wannabe Slug
Wannabe Slug
Posts: 643
Joined: 20 Jan 2005, 21:49
Contact:

Post by all_against_all » 11 Apr 2007, 18:09

Unfortunately yes, i was thinking of reviving the thread the other day in fact because the telltale signs are not as obvious, particles are smaller and you cant feel the crunch, but they're still there, the ukcia forum is following the whole thing pretty well.

I've pretty much given up smoking weed now until my mates plants are ready, it's jut not worth the hassle, and your throat gets fooked, it's lame.

Even worse is the various people i have smoked with all have draw that's tainted in some way, and it's all off different dealers too, it's bloody everywhere!

I presume you have a reliable source then, eh?

User avatar
chippy
Snail Of Satan
Snail Of Satan
Posts: 30353
Joined: 18 Aug 2003, 20:39
Location: Newbury
Contact:

Post by chippy » 12 Apr 2007, 09:31

you could say that.

i had no idea it was still about. lame.

edit: got a link to the latest? most recent update i can find is january.
Image They reckon one day you'll be able to wake up and eat a yoghurt you can have a conversation with.

Dannnn
Cool Snail
Cool Snail
Posts: 7224
Joined: 09 Apr 2002, 00:21
Contact:

Post by Dannnn » 12 Apr 2007, 13:22

I'll have a look at my weed later to see if it's gritty at all.

I'll also write a response to the points raised in this thread later.
Image

User avatar
-dabadanselecta-
Ameoba of Satan
Ameoba of Satan
Posts: 397
Joined: 16 Mar 2007, 16:03
Location: Thatcham
Contact:

Post by -dabadanselecta- » 11 Jun 2007, 15:56

legalize everything 100% and if you can grow it then should the government have the right to tax it or control it ,they dont make you pay tax on ya spuds you grow in the garden or any other plant.

and shitting heck the effects you can get of some of the legal drugs like salvia for instance well if thats leagal then they all should be
sheeple - I need a laptop -

User avatar
jo_rhymes
Ameoba of Satan
Ameoba of Satan
Posts: 381
Joined: 21 May 2007, 01:33
Location: Newbury
Contact:

Post by jo_rhymes » 11 Jun 2007, 22:34

i don't think it's right that alcohol and tobacco are legal and cannabis isn't.

metal_dave
Snail God
Snail God
Posts: 20772
Joined: 22 Jul 2003, 23:05
Contact:

Post by metal_dave » 11 Jun 2007, 22:42

i think they should put ecstacy in the water.
Image

User avatar
phillip_banks
Snail
Snail
Posts: 5178
Joined: 24 Sep 2003, 12:37
Location: Wood-To-Tha-Motherfuckin'-Cote
Contact:

Post by phillip_banks » 11 Jun 2007, 23:04

I think they should put water in ecstasy. OH NO, LEA BETTS1!!

User avatar
counterfeit
Snail Legend
Snail Legend
Posts: 16117
Joined: 09 Jul 2002, 22:56
Location: Newbury
Contact:

Post by counterfeit » 11 Jun 2007, 23:28

-dabadanselecta- wrote:
and shitting heck the effects you can get of some of the legal drugs like salvia for instance well if thats leagal then they all should be


my brother's got one of those plants. me and daveeey had some. didn't do NUFFIN though. however my brother claims he was rolling on the floor laughing..? i reckon he took something else without telling.
I'll find a new life and hide,
If I survive.

Tomaroundtheworld
Cool Snail
Cool Snail
Posts: 6327
Joined: 19 May 2003, 16:36
Location: Woolhampton
Contact:

Post by Tomaroundtheworld » 11 Jun 2007, 23:57

I find it easy enough to pick up anyway.

And pills can be shit if you're expecting a mellow, euphoric rushy time and end up speeding your tits off. Or if you want to be going all night and get ket heavy ones. But I like it when it catches you off guard and ends up being really nice.

But seriously, two of my mates are doing this for their dissertations. I don't think I could offer a sensible contribution to this right now though. If there was a way to cut out the social issues at the source, with drugs like cocaine for example, it'd be good, but I don't know if it would. It's not as if multi-national companies don't exploit South American countries and fuck about with their politics anyway, so even if coke became legal I wouldn't start doing it.

As for problems in this country, I don't think legalising heroin, crack or crystal meth is going to do anything to deter people from taking them, or help to encourage people who are already addicts to get themselves off. If they start to administer free hits, it's just going to be more free hits for the addicts. And if they regulate it, people are just going to go back to their dealers and carrying on stealing or prostituting to fund the money to get the hits outside their regulations. I don't see any way how they could make it work really.

Weed and Mushrooms are ridiculous and we all know that anyway. There's no real reason for either of those to be illegal. Especially fucking class A for fresh mushrooms. I honestly can't think of a reason for that other than the fact that people were enjoying them too much. And I'm sure legalising could help get rid of gritty draw and the like too. The only defence is seeing Cannabis as a 'gateway' drug, which as much as we all like to deny it, has a lot of truth. Personally, I took class As before I ever smoked, but I know I'm massively in the minority. But then would alcohol not be seen as a gateway drug too? It's just in the eyes of politicians it's seen as an 'evil' drug, but you know they've never been anywhere near a J.

Actually, I realise I could go on and on about this and not really get anywhere. I don't think it'd be worthwhile legalising a couple and keeping others illegal, as I'm sure that'd cause more uproar than if nothing happened. But I think it was a ridiculous decision reclassifying 'shrooms, and weed shouldn't really be illegal. But for the sake of that, I wouldn't want to see anything like Coke, Meth, Crack, Heroin etc etc legalised.

And if none of this really makes sense, it's 'cause I was kind of thinking out loud. I never intended on typing any of this.

User avatar
chippy
Snail Of Satan
Snail Of Satan
Posts: 30353
Joined: 18 Aug 2003, 20:39
Location: Newbury
Contact:

Post by chippy » 12 Jun 2007, 09:26

counterfeit wrote:
-dabadanselecta- wrote:
and shitting heck the effects you can get of some of the legal drugs like salvia for instance well if thats leagal then they all should be


my brother's got one of those plants. me and daveeey had some. didn't do NUFFIN though. however my brother claims he was rolling on the floor laughing..? i reckon he took something else without telling.


Nah, you have to either smoke an utter fuckload really quickly, or use the 10x or 20x strength extracts.
Image They reckon one day you'll be able to wake up and eat a yoghurt you can have a conversation with.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest